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Post by Admin on Jul 3, 2021 4:14:00 GMT
I think that things are going well. All the threads seem to be moving along at the speed of player desire. I do sometimes tend to try and push things along for a few reasons: people tend to drop out if nothing happens, so if I think things are slowing down too much, I will push, and even if things are happening, if there is no resolution in sight then people will also drop so there may be sudden changes in tone. As always, be sure to know that 'a wizard did it' is the usual explanation.
Some things happen that are completely beyond my reckoning or planning, like when Alan and Gavin decided to go to the resort. The whole thing with having Simone be photographed by paparazzi was just a bit of colour I added to show her celebrity status - I didn't think that someone would actually go to the resort. Not a problem because I enjoyed coming up with the interruptions and ball. A & G might not have been as amused!
To be continued....
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Post by Admin on Jul 3, 2021 11:49:17 GMT
pt 2:
Shadow is an odd thing. It is as much, if not more, a construction made of thought than it is of matter. That is why shadow resources exist as part of the Pattern's powers: if someone can imagine it, then it will exist.
This leads to an issue with our pal Brennon and is one reason I haven't yet replied to his last post. He assumes that Flora's party will attract some kind of disaster/invasion/major trouble that he recruited his invasion force to stop. If he had full Pattern, then such a thing would definitely exit whether I thought of it or not, but since he has Broken Pattern, would he still be able to create it? Maybe I have something planned, or maybe I don't. Would the debased Pattern grant his desire but in a twisted or ironic form? I'm still deciding but hopefully will have an answer by the end of the weekend.
To be continued...
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Post by Admin on Jul 6, 2021 2:10:20 GMT
pt 3:
Moving in Shadow. This will probably annoy or scare a few of you. Mostly annoy. Multiple parts and posts coming up...
Meta-motion
Some NPCs and things are mostly in place and will be relatively easy to reach when travelling through Shadow; Flora will most likely be in Amber, Merlin in the Courts o' Chaos, Moire in Rebma, etc. Others will be moving, and assuming the PCs and NPCs have the same means to move through shadow, and I will understand where the NPC is going and where they will meet the PCs. Every time the PCs deviate from heading towards the NPC they will become further apart, and the NPC will be a 'step' forward in their journey.
Sometimes this will benefit the PCs if the NPC gets into trouble, but usually, it will just drag out storylines which is why Shelly can say '...and we are no closer to finding Dorian' while they are in Kasaba. Of course, she could be wrong.
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Post by Admin on Jul 6, 2021 2:17:42 GMT
pt 4:
Travel within a shadow to find something or someone goes quicker using conventional means. Trying to use the Pattern or some other power while staying in the same shadow is much slower than riding or driving, etc. If time is a concern, then avoid the Patterns or Logrus. Sorcery would be quick once the spell is cast which could take hours to research, prepare, and cast, and the sorcerer would need some way to connect or identify the spell's subject. A doubtful proposition for between shadows, but likely to succeed within a shadow.
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Post by Admin on Jul 6, 2021 2:49:15 GMT
pt 5:
Finding an object in Shadow:
Infuriating to me is the rules' mention that psyche is the 'agility to manipulate Pattern, Logrus, etc.' yet aside from mentioning the minimums needed to acquire a power nothing else is said. While the rules seem to be written to void complex calculations, I disapprove of this gap in the rules. The book says items can be found after 1 day of hellriding per point which I also don't like because hellride is quick and rough while finding a special item should require more care.
So my proposed rule is this:
2 days per point to find an item, multiplied by the PC's psyche rank (1 through 5 for the current 5 PCs) multiplied by 1.5 for Logrus, 3 for Broken Pattern, and 5 by 'shadow seek' power in an item, then multiplied again by half the character's Endurance rank.
As an example let's say a 2nd rank psyche and 4th rank endurance used Pattern to look for a 2 point item. (2x2) x 2 x 4/2 = 16 days!
Buy items and don't go searching for stuff! Or be sure to have Pattern and invest heavily in psy and end!
But what is time in Shadow? What does the word 'days' mean? Just that all the other characters and NPCs move farther and fartheraway from the searcher. Again, not so bad if you need an item to use in the assassination of Merlin or someone in a fixed location but if you want an item to use intercept Brennon's fleet of insane Vikings you will probably return to Amber long after the sacking and looting is done.
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Post by Hammett on Jul 6, 2021 17:32:04 GMT
But since we don't know our rankings we can't work out how long it would take. Will you let us know our rankings? If we are unknowingly 5th rank in both Psych and Endurance we could spend a year looking for an item. Say 4 pt. item, so 8 days, x5 (5th rank PSY) = 40 days, x3 for broken pattern (which it seems most people have) = 120 days x2.5 (for 5th rank END) = 300 days total, for what the rules suggest should only take 4 days.
So while I agree 4 days seems to quick, possibly 300 days seems way too long.
This whole campaign, since I first started, has probably not been going on for more then 100 days as near as I can estimate.
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Post by Admin on Jul 6, 2021 18:29:15 GMT
Id toy want to get an idea of your rankings then get competing with eachother! Or don't go searching for expensive items and pay for them instead.
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Post by Hammett on Jul 6, 2021 19:00:17 GMT
Can we suggest other formulas?
How about (2x Point total of item unless you have Advanced Pattern or Advanced Logrus then it is 1x point total) x (x1 with Pattern, x2 with Logrus, x3 Broken Pattern, x4 Shadow Seek) x (1 x PSYCH Rank) x (.5x END Rank)
This works out to someone who was the "Best" and had Pattern, Plus was Rank 1 in Psych and Rank 1 in END would still only take 1 day to find a 1 pt item, but then they paid all those points to not only have Pattern, but also Rank 1 in two Stats. So that was a lot of points spent, and should be a benefit to them and it could be their "schtick" to find stuff quickly in shadow.
While the worst person possible, would be 2x4x5x2.5 = 100 days to find a 1 pt item. So, 100x worse then the best person.
With an "average" player (with Broken Pattern) it would take: 2x3x3x1.5 = 27 days for a 1 pt. item.
An "average" Player with Pattern it would take: 2x1x3x1.5 = 9 days to find a 1pt item
That feels to me to be a more reasonable "spread" of times required. And if more player join (or re-join) then the worst would get worse (X6 or more because of lower Psych Rank and End rank)
Plus there can be other modifiers, close to Amber might add a x2 multiplier to the total (harder to shift shadow and change things), while close to Chaos might be a x.5 modifier as things are easier. Shadow Storms and other "events" might also add a x2 (or more) multiplier as traveling is difficult.
just some random thoughts off the top of my head.
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Post by Brian on Jul 6, 2021 21:57:22 GMT
But since we don't know our rankings we can't work out how long it would take. Will you let us know our rankings? If we are unknowingly 5th rank in both Psych and Endurance we could spend a year looking for an item. Say 4 pt. item, so 8 days, x5 (5th rank PSY) = 40 days, x3 for broken pattern (which it seems most people have) = 120 days x2.5 (for 5th rank END) = 300 days total, for what the rules suggest should only take 4 days. So while I agree 4 days seems to quick, possibly 300 days seems way too long. This whole campaign, since I first started, has probably not been going on for more then 100 days as near as I can estimate. Addendum:
It depends on what we are talking about in "Finding an Item" or "Finding a person"
Finding the Gae Bolga (For example) would take a long time because its a very specific item vs finding "A Mech Suit" which is important but also less specific. Vs finding something trivial
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Post by Admin on Jul 7, 2021 5:49:08 GMT
Finding a person is different. Why? I don't know, but it is for game reasons. Basically, unlike the rules that make things very easy to find, I think that it is better to make those get-out-of-jail-free cards more difficult to acquire. If a character is faced with a problem, it would be better and more fun to have the player figure out a solution with what is at hand rather than quickly running out into shadow to pick up a toy to use. It turns into that Tom and Jerry or Itchy and Scratchy bit with them hitting each other with a series of large and larger mallets. In the game, that seems, to my mind, a copout.
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Post by Brennon on Jul 7, 2021 19:43:08 GMT
I tend to use those time guidelines (in more recent years) as the time required to acquire an object, **if** the points are being spent. If no points are spent, then it may take 10 times as long, or at least the question of finding, acquiring, and getting away with it will take longer. Also, I get to have it break, get lost, or get stolen at any point that it becomes an annoyance to the gm.
If Eivor wants a new pair of fancy magic (points actually being spent) boots, how long would it take her to find it? If Hammett wants to spend the points for a Merlin-killing weapon, can he get it? Will his points be refunded after he kills Merlin, or is he basically permanently weaker than the rest of his generation? That penalty itself might curb most NPCs from taking that course of assassination.
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Post by Hammett on Jul 7, 2021 19:59:44 GMT
If Hammett wants to spend the points for a Merlin-killing weapon, can he get it? Will his points be refunded after he kills Merlin, Hey! I'm already suspected in killing one King, don't go giving the GM ideas about framing me for another!  |
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Post by Brian on Jul 7, 2021 22:32:05 GMT
If Hammett wants to spend the points for a Merlin-killing weapon, can he get it? Will his points be refunded after he kills Merlin, Hey! I'm already suspected in killing one King, don't go giving the GM ideas about framing me for another! I suspect you were framed to motivate you to do things |
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Post by Admin on Jul 8, 2021 0:33:23 GMT
Look at it this way: to go from no suspected king assassinations to one is a huge step. But once you are on the hook for one it is a far smaller step to add a second. Therefore everyone should be piling all suspicions anout everything onto Hammett. I mean, at least one of the PCs must be friends with Coy....
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Post by Brian on Jul 8, 2021 3:53:06 GMT
Look at it this way: to go from no suspected king assassinations to one is a huge step. But once you are on the hook for one it is a far smaller step to add a second. Therefore everyone should be piling all suspicions anout everything onto Hammett. I mean, at least one of the PCs must be friends with Coy.... But to the point of the Merlin Murdering Item:
Conjuration is the way to find that (over Pattern)
But I can think of several excellent items for murdering merlin. While they are specific items, I am not looking specifically for the Axe intended to behead Loki. I am looking for an item to kill Merlin and I think the Axe intended to kill loki would be a set within the set of items that could kill merlin.
So in this example the Axe intended to take Loki's head shouldn't cost as much as the "Spear of Merlin slaying" [in time anyway]
But you are really telling me I should have given Brian magic :-p
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